A Conversation with a Heretic

Posted by Rachel in Uncategorized (Saturday November 22, 2003 at 6:21 pm)

The other day, my parents & Rick and I all went and talked to a Lutheran minister (belonging to the Free Lutheran denomination) about the issue that I’m dealing with at my church. We had a great time talking about the issue itself. Pastor Wagley’s remarks were great, such as, “I don’t baptize people just for the kick of it. If it didn’t do anything, what would be the purpose?” He also said, “You know, you should ask your accusers to find a passage in Scripture that says ‘baptism doesn’t save you.’ We’ve already got ours that says that it does.” About halfway through the meeting, Pastor Wagley’s daughter came downstairs and we were introduced to her. Her name also happened to be Rachel, and she also happened to be a “troublemaker” because of her beliefs regarding baptism. She was going to be a counselor for a Franklin Graham crusade, and in the bio she had to fill out, under the question, “When did you become a Christian?” she wrote, “When I was baptized as an infant.” This caused a lot of concern for the administration, and she was told that she wouldn’t be able to be a counselor. So, she ran to get her dad, who told those silly administration people, “Hey, I’m a Lutheran minister, and I teach this.” Thankfully, she was then able to be a counselor. I wish it’d be that easy for me.

11 Responses to “A Conversation with a Heretic”

  1. mike Says:
    November 22nd, 2003 at 9:16 pm

    Yeah, well, Luther was a Catholic. You shouldn’t read him. You should read the pre-Luther protestants. I hear it’s an easy read.

  2. Solomon Says:
    November 23rd, 2003 at 12:41 pm

    Yay for the Bible! :D

    Proverbs 10:8 - The wise in heart will receive commandments: but a prating fool shall fall.

    Proverbs 10:10 - He that winketh with the eye causeth sorrow: but a prating fool shall fall.

    Proverbs 10:23 - It is as sport to a fool to do mischief: but a man of understanding hath wisdom.

    Proverbs 11:29 - He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind: and the fool shall be servant to the wise of heart.

  3. Christopher Witmer Says:
    November 23rd, 2003 at 1:39 pm

    Can’t argue with that! Amen.

  4. Eucharis Says:
    November 24th, 2003 at 6:59 pm

    Wow, if Rachel and the Lutherans are heretics, I’m in big trouble — at my chuch, not only do we baptize infants, we go all the way and let them participate in the Eucharist, too! Well, as soon as they can handle solid food. ;) I guess I’m a big bad troublemakers who ought to be shunned for my heresy, too.

    At least I’m in good company.

  5. jen Says:
    November 25th, 2003 at 4:48 pm

    Oh goody! I’m a Lutheran heretic!

    *dances around and sings for joy*

  6. Eucharis Says:
    November 25th, 2003 at 4:54 pm

    We should start a club! We could call it the Heretical Orthodoxy Club. Wonder if that domain name’s free? ;>

  7. kristen Says:
    November 25th, 2003 at 9:05 pm

    I’m in!

  8. mike Says:
    November 26th, 2003 at 10:26 am

    I’d be in too, but since my wife already jumped in, I’m required to follow in after her.

  9. Josh S Says:
    December 1st, 2003 at 7:02 am

    I’ve always known that I’m a heretic. I’m a heretic yes I know, for the Council of Trent tells me so…

  10. Dosson // 1voicecrying Says:
    November 2nd, 2007 at 8:19 pm

    Hi Rachael,

    I hope all turned out well for you at your job.

    Ephesians 2:8-9, For we are saved by Grace through faith and that not of ourselves that no man may boast.
    Abraham believed, had faith in, God and this, his faith, was accounted to him for
    Righteousness. Our Righteousness is firmly secure in the work Christ did on the cross, not on the work we do being baptized or work of our parents when we are sprinkled. The water itself is representative of the Blood of Christ that we must be immersed in Him and receive after immersion, faith in Christ, then the Baptism of the Holy Spirit that Jesus sends then to dwell in us a Temple of God not made by hands.

    We are saved by faith in what Christ did, not what we can do. No not baptism, prayer, repentance, tithing, preaching the Gospel, helping little old ladies across the street, No, nothing but faith in the Blood of Jesus.
    Baptism is the 1st good work we do.

  11. Rick Says:
    November 2nd, 2007 at 10:15 pm

    *sigh*

    Sorry, we believe God does the work of baptism, not us. Silly anabaptists.

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