Tom Schwegler offers insight into why contemporary music makes congregational singing difficult over on the Internet Monk’s blog.
I think Schwegler is right on. I’ve always had a problem with finding a way to incorporate contemporary music in such a way that it’s good for the congregation. I think Schwegler put some of my own thoughts into the words I couldn’t find. His points sum up my own thoughts:
Complexity: Many contemporary songs are made for soloists, not congregations. Nothing is worse to me than a passionate band singing for the congregation. That just irks me. It makes true the charge of entertainment worship.
Less information: As someone who doesn’t read music, but can generally follow notes (most of the time), I find it quite annoying to go into a church and hear a song I’ve never heard before and expect to sing it. Sometimes I can; sometimes I can’t. I want to see the music.
More oral tradition:It also vexes me to hear a worship leader sing a song contrary to the way you might hear it on CCM. I want to know what I am singing before I start singing or at least have a road map.
Chords vs. tunes: I’ve always been fond of a piano or organ (mostly piano) leading worship (Forrest is trying to convince me a guitar and drums are better, but now I’ve obtained newly read ammunition!). I’ve never understood why I felt that guitar didn’t work as well for leading congregational music, but I think Schwegler’s right in asserting it’s because guitars play chords, not tunes. It may also be that I am partial to piano over guitars; I hardly ever see anyone play an acoustic guitar in a way that doesn’t sound cheap when it comes to worship. My wife assures me that it’s just because I’ve never been in a church that plays acoustic guitars well, but I think it’s because my Catholic-Lutheran upbringing has given me a particular standard of what music should sound like.
July 26th, 2008 at 1:35 pm
I read what he said and can agree with some of it, but I don’t know that his opinion can lead to the conclusion that contemporary music is more difficult for congregations. I grew up in a church that sang every style of music. Most of the people in the church were very musically inclined as well. Some people loved hymns and some loved learning new songs. To the later the old songs because stale and lost their meaning.. to the former the old songs meant more the more they sang them.
Though it is interesting to know what you like and what the other guy likes that you referred I think we all need to be careful about making sweeping statements about music and worship. Worship is not for us, but for God. He’s the only one who knows if our worship is sincere or pleasing in His sight.
When I was younger and I’d be singing harmonies and singing loudly or whatever other people told me that I was being proud and “showing off” but in my heart those were the times that I was praising God and really didn’t know that anyone could hear me but him. The times when I really was trying to show my skill off were the times when my voice would clench up and I couldn’t sing as good as I did before.
The thing that bothers me the most in congregational worship is when people sing poorly and out of tune. Does that mean it is less pleasing in the sight of God? If they are doing their best and their heart is right then He is pleased. It is my own fault for being distracted by how they sing. If I don’t know a song and can’t pick it up easily, does that mean that I should say that those people who are praising God should stop to accommodate me or should I still be worshiping him even if I can’t sing along with the congregation?
I say all this, but I do agree that the people leading or accompanying the songs do need to be careful not to embellish the melody if no one knows the tune and that having a piano player playing the melody is quite helpful and so forth. I think my only disagreement was just the sweeping concussion. I’ve heard so many people with their different beefs about music and worship and in the end.. I think all of us are so different and, though a lot of caution is appropriate in what songs we use and how we play and sing them, I don’t think we can say that one way is the best for everyone.
Why are their so many different denominations in the U.S. especially? Is it because we insist that our way is the best? I do think many things in how we worship can be improved, but the main thing that needs to be improved is our hearts. When something bothers me in the singing and music it is sometimes appropriate to change those things, but sometimes it’s more appropriate to change myself and realize that the thing that bothers me is my own problem. If it interferes with my communion with God and other people perhaps it’s not them? Perhaps it’s me. (Of course it could be them too, but that’s generally easier for us to see which is why I’m just pointing out for all of us to look at ourselves first.)
Now, I’ve said all this.. and I’m sure someone is going to be offended or get offensive by something or other that I said and probably misunderstand the things that I wrote. So I’ll leave it like this and let everyone agree or disagree with me. I would like to say that none of this was meant to accuse or correct anyone.. it’s just some stuff I’ve learned and thought I’d share since it went with this post. I used to get upset when someone would tell me how such and such a song wasn’t as good as another. It would bother me because the song they said was bad I sang like a prayer and in my heart was telling God that He was the only important thing in my life. But.. now I see that maybe those people were just so much different than me that even though they were telling God the same thing they were doing it in a different way and simply preferred different music that they thought said that better.
Oh, and I agree about it being much easier to sing songs with the music! I do really like that as well. I’m thinking though of what David might have sung and how the Psalms were the contemporary music (if you will) of the day! They didn’t write music down (if at all) like we do now. It was tunes that people had learned by ear. They also didn’t have organs or pianos. They didn’t even have the modern type harps. David played a Lyre with probably 12 strings or so (I used to know, but I forgot for sure.) Anyway, it would be interesting to study more about what it might have been like then.
We can go around and around the real issue with what everyone likes and all of our own experiences. Growing up in different denominations and hearing different musical styles can really effect our perceptions now. Maybe if we can’t put up (in a sense) with the preferences of other believers than it’s better that we do have so many different denominations and worship styles. I was really blessed to grow up in a church that used so many types of music and styles and instruments. There were people on both sides of the issue that had beefs with the other kind of music too.
Anyway, interesting subject.
I’ll be on facebook for further discussion if anyone wants to talk about it more. Or in person which would be even better! Somehow it never turns out to be as edifying of a discussion through the computer, but I figured I should write out my first thoughts just for something for other people to chew on. Chewing is good.. no one has to swallow though if the chewing doesn’t go well.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:24 pm
Lynne’,
I agree with 99% of what you said. For me, it’s not an issue of taste or style. Stylistically, I like a lot of contemporary music. Objectively, I am pretty sure it’s more complex, and without the music or without hearing it, it’s harder for me to pick up on, and it’s harder for congregations to sing because of the wide range of notes, the keys that are often chosen, or the ways the notes go together (here I can’t find the right words because I don’t know the musical terms for the examples in my head). I strongly wish that congregations that sing mostly contemporary would give me the music, play whole tunes, and provide time to practice the tunes before the service.
That said, if you’ve been around CCM more than I have, you would probably pick up the tunes faster because you’d be more used to the style as a whole.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
And just FYI, when I said, ” I’ve always had a problem with finding a way to incorporate contemporary music in such a way that it’s good for the congregation,” I don’t think I was clearly expressing what I meant.
What I was getting at is the all too common phenomena of contemporary congregations not singing because it’s too complex for them, so they just let the praise band’s praise be their praise. I find this sad and disheartening.
July 27th, 2008 at 8:38 pm
The thing about guitars vs. pianos is really a non-issue, as you could have an additional instrument playing the melody line. And also some piano players only play chords. Just my 2 cents. I have a personal preference for a variety of instruments, not necessarily all played every time, but as the music demands, certain instruments for certain songs.
July 27th, 2008 at 8:40 pm
But I do realize that some bands really don’t have any instrumental melody line being played, and I have experienced this difficulty. Especially when the melody line is only being sung, and by a guy who likes to be “creative” with the notes.
July 27th, 2008 at 9:12 pm
Rebekah,
I agree that a lot depends on the pianist, but I would take a good pianist over a good guitarist when it comes to LEAD instruments that are playing the melody. When it comes to leading a congregational music, I think you need a superb, or even professional, guitarist to compare to a good, well-trained, pianist–which are much more common.
I, too, like a variety of instrucments, but I think the congregation has to be considered first, and I would say the majority of guitarists just don’t compare with the majority of the pianists.
Having a guitar lead all your music also limits you stylistically, and it’s much more common to get your “creative” guitarists and soloists with than “creative” cantors/pianists (though I’ve been annoyed at several pianists who are there more to perform than to lead worship).
July 28th, 2008 at 12:38 pm
I think Lynne’ nailed it on the head when she said,”Our heart is the real issue”. I feel like when I get annoyed at someone playing, it ’s me not them that has the problem. We really have no way of knowing what anyone is really thinking when they are worshiping. I have no doubt that God loves my little children praising him loud, off key and a lot of the time with the wrong words just as much as he does the talented people up front.
This is a little off from what you guys were saying but, I had to write it I am a little annoyed at something someone said the other day… (No, it wasn’t any of you). LOL
July 28th, 2008 at 2:08 pm
I agree that whether or not we can “enter in” to a certain style is an issue of the heart. That is not at all what he’s really referring to.
What he’s getting at, and what I am getting at, is not really a question of whether or not you like the style or can get into a style. What I’m getting at has to do with making music accessible enough that people of all ability levels can actually sing along and sing along vibrantly (if they so choose).
It’s more about difficulty and making it easier on your congregants to be ABLE to follow–not about making it what they like so they choose to follow along.
July 28th, 2008 at 2:59 pm
Rick,
I didn’t mean a good guitarist playing the melody line, I meant a different instrument altogether.
July 28th, 2008 at 3:59 pm
Oh, I understand.
More thoughts (not arguing with your point):
I think guitars and electric guitars are great as backup instruments.
I have a hard time with acoustic guitars leading because I think it makes it more difficult for visitors and those less musically inclined to catch on. Now if you had a good classical guitarist that played whole tunes and played well, I think that’d be great. Those are just rare musicians. If Sons of Korah went to your church, then it’d be a different story.
I think electric guitarists work better as lead instrumentalists, but the problem there is that you limit yourself in style when you break out the electric guitar and especially the drum kit. It’s hard to have that style lead something like chant, and it’s hard to sing more acoustic feeling songs with a drum kit.
July 28th, 2008 at 10:55 pm
I totally agree. (How awesome would it be to have Sons of Korah-calibre musicians at your church??)
July 29th, 2008 at 1:19 am
hmm.. I can see where you are going I think? About what would be easy for a congregation to sing, but not all congregations are alike. I don’t think it’s about what people like or choose to sing with though. Some people are just so unaccustomed to traditional church music that they have the same difficulty as someone on the other end trying to follow contemporary singers. So, I still maintain that I disagree with the sweeping statement of what is easiest for a congregation to sing. But I do agree that the “worship team” shouldn’t be leading the worship so much so that no one can follow. I’ve been in some big churches like that and don’t think it’s good at all. If we are comparing those “bands” and the traditional hymns I can see why anyone would think that the later is easier for a congregation to join in with.
The contemporary songs and traditional songs though don’t have anything to do with that. We’re really then talking more about how people play songs rather than what songs they are.. which I think is closer to the main problem than what those songs are.
Getting back to the heart issue… as someone who’s lead worship music my goal should always be to glorify God as I sing and play. I don’t know if those people who are embellishing the songs melody are singing to praise themselves or God. I don’t know. I do think it’s part of a leaders job to actually lead though.. not to worship by themselves. I sing differently when I’m leading and when I’m sitting in the congregation. I don’t sing many harmonies for one thing because the point of leading is to lead… not perform. It is different when you are leading because you can’t just have your heart right with God and praise him like you were in the congregation because you are in a place of service and must think about the people you are serving with your ability.
On a side note.. when we talk about good and not as good singers. When I was in our church choir the director would say that we didn’t need to be so focused on sounding good because we were singing to God. I’d just like to say that we do need to do our best.. in one way even more BECAUSE we are singing to God. I think this is somewhat different in a congregation or in a concert. I don’t want to make mistakes because I don’t want that to distract from the message and interfere with the blessing that someone could enjoy. On the other hand we don’t want to do really well because we want to look good to people. It’s complicated. And no one can know by watching what our hearts are doing. It seems like when ever people think that I’m so spiritual or so obviously close to God is the times when I’m the most distant and not as in tune with what he’s saying to me.
Anyway… more to chew on…
July 29th, 2008 at 1:48 am
I can see Lynne’s perspective on how for some, traditional music might be easier to follow than contemporary, but for others, the opposite is true.
But, I can also see how we should be looking beyond what people’s exposures to different styles have been and how that dictates what’s easier for them to follow, and look into what’s inherently the best music for congregational worship. I don’t think it’s purely subjective and relative to the situation or congregation; there are clearly certain musical styles that fit, objectively, better in one context than in another. I’m not sure that I’ve decided on a clear cut answer for what style(s) of music would be better for congregational singing, but I think there may be an answer if we search willingly.
Also, perhaps we all think of different things when we say “contemporary.” For some, that brings to mind praise choruses and a worship band — for others, Marty Haugen settings with piano accompaniment. The truth of the matter is, most praise choruses that I am familiar with are taken from songs written by/for CCM artists, and so the tune may not be geared towards congregational singing, but rather with a soloist or small group in mind. Songs with unpredictable or fluid rhythms are naturally going to be more difficult for a congregation to sing in unison. Music that is composed specifically with the congregation in mind should be easier for a congregation to pick up.
So, maybe it has less to do with whether it’s contemporary and more to do with how the song is written and what it’s geared toward (soloist/small singing group, or congregation).
July 29th, 2008 at 2:19 am
Lynne’ and Rachel,
I think you both make some good points. Lynne’, I do think how it is played is a big part of it. And I do agree that people used to CCM will jump into contemporary style more easily than those who do not. I think that they can also jump into traditional more easily than traditionalists can jump into contemporary. For two reasons 1) Traditional music is usually played more fully (whole tunes). 2) The second reason is that traditional music is less complex. I think Rachel is correct and clear in her assessment:
“The truth of the matter is, most praise choruses that I am familiar with are taken from songs written by/for CCM artists, and so the tune may not be geared towards congregational singing, but rather with a soloist or small group in mind. Songs with unpredictable or fluid rhythms are naturally going to be more difficult for a congregation to sing in unison. Music that is composed specifically with the congregation in mind should be easier for a congregation to pick up.”
This is the heart of what I am getting at. On the whole, contemporary music is not geared toward the congregation. I think that can be helped by 1) Providing music 2) Practice.
That’s what I was trying to get across in my original post. Too often, you’re not given music, you’re given no time to practice, and the songs are not singable because the band is performing rather than leading.
I’m not saying that makes contemporary worse, but rather that it provides more hurdles that worship leaders need to be aware of.
July 29th, 2008 at 4:31 pm
I guess it would help to have more specific examples because I’ve known many praise songs that are boringly simplistic and terribly easy to learn and also some quite complicated traditional songs. It is probably the most accurate to say that simple songs are going to be the easiest for congregations to sing together. Yes. I still don’t think that falls just to contemporary or traditional though. Because if you really look at the older songs and their keys or certain jumps of the notes from each other .. is it an unusual jump or an easy one? Is it minor, major, have accidentals thrown in to make it more complicated? Would the contemporary songs be more simple without the harmonies and how they are presented? A lot of them are actually quite boring without those added things where as the traditional songs (in my opinion) lend themselves more to complicated melodies but are presented in a more simplistic way. As you’ve said. So, is it the fault of the actual tune? Or is it how it is presented? I don’t know that we really can split Christian music into contemporary or traditional when you consider how many years of preserved Christian music we have. The songs from the eighties for instance is different from the songs written now.
So.. in the end *reading back over Ricks previous comment* I think we all mostly agree we are just saying it in a different way. Whether it’s easier for someone to go from the new to the old or the old to new and what would be easier I think it depends on the person. Some people can’t read music but are great at learning by hearing.. others have to have the music.
Is there a right or wrong kind of music? Can we find it? I think we can for ourselves and some people around us, but I wouldn’t want to be too dogmatic about what is right or wrong when only God knows and other Christians are admittedly quite different from each other. If we try too hard to find just that right kind of music than we could end up like the people in Jesus time that were following the letter of the law and adding more too it, but forgetting the attitude of the heart which was harder to keep in line and also what the whole point was. Not that we shouldn’t strive for that, but we also shouldn’t be too strict about what is acceptable and unacceptable (there should be some of that of course when it is clearly not in line with scripture or something, but I mean the difference between one christian song and another, or one style and another.)
It is important that we are sensitive to what is easiest for a congregation to sing and help people learn the song or practice it or have music. These are important things. We don’t want any distractions in the way when we are all together to worship, but is that more important than a gentle and quiet spirit? What is more pleasing to God? If I don’t know a song in church is it better for me to be bothered or annoyed by not being able to sing with the congregation (which I have been) or can I still be worshiping Him even if I’m not singing? I’ve kind of been going through a lot of this… sort of like a winter in worshiping God with other believers, and our church is getting to the point where they are changing how they lead the singing and so forth. It’s really great for me! And while I really do agree with almost everything you all have said I just think it’s important to work on ourselves before trying to fix other problems (even if they really do need to be fixed I think it’s up to God to lead us in a specific way to do something about it or if he wants us to learn something in our silence.)
I really don’t know what all of my ramblings would mean to other people reading this.. it’s just what I’ve been learning over quite a few years now.
We’re all talking in general ways too and not specifics so maybe there isn’t a specific problem it’s just a general thing that was noticed. It is good to figure this stuff out though, and I think we all pretty much agree with each other.. so .. I don’t know that my adding this really means much except to point out again the importance of taking note of that which can’t be noticed in anyone but ourselves. It would be interesting if we did want to be more specific to ask people what songs, to them, make them think only about God. Or which ones help them recognize how great He is or how small we are or something else that has to do with our attitudes in worship and what helps to bring our hearts and minds into a humble worshipful state. We’d then have to be even more specific as to what songs, how they are presented, different ones in different styles, and many more specifics that would make this conversation too complicated to become a general rule for the masses. Even the order of songs can change the presentation. This is really much more complicated than we can talk about on here. And that’s just the external stuff that can come up for debate, but what is more important? If our hearts are in line with God, if we are striving to be like David “A man after God’s own heart” than He will direct us to what should and should not be sung, what order, and what style, and all in context to the occasion.
I’m not saying that anyone here isn’t doing that. I really don’t know. How could
Probably some people are thinking, “Of course our attitudes are important and it’s not just what we do.” I just don’t like leaving something that important to go unsaid and be like we all know that already so lets get onto what music is better or worse (It’s really easy for me to get stuck on the trivial stuff and forget this.) It’s easy to talk about tangible things. It was easy for the jews to recognize that murder was sin, but Jesus said that if we hate someone in our heart it is the same as murder in God’s sight.
We should try to figure out what is better to sing and the music leaders should be sensitive to God’s leading when they lead the congregation. It really is important. I’m not saying that we shouldn’t or that anything anyone has said is unimportant. I just didn’t want to get too into the one side without reiterating the more important issue of worship.